CHAT ARCHIVE - 11-28-1998-Character Creation

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       ICQ Chat Save file    
Started on Sun Nov 29 02:56:46 1998

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<Casey> Does everyone have a character name and goal in mind?
<Bookpal> Yes, I do - same one if that's ok
<Minky5> well sort of ... it's been a busy week
<Casey> That's great, Bookie.  I've already briefly met Anna.
<Bookpal> Good memory, Casey
<Casey> Then I won't call on you first, Minky.  I'll give you time to
collect your thoughts.
<Minky5> thanks Casey
<Casey> ICQ is behaving, so I'm going to go ahead and start class.  We are
to have 3 others join us later that I'm aware of--not counting Chip, our
fearless and tardy sysop
<Casey> Shall I pick on you first, since I know something about your
character already?
<Bookpal> Sure
<Casey> Rename her and give her goal, for those who weren't here last time?
<Bookpal> Anna and her goal is to convince the FBI her husband is not who
they think he is
<Casey> i.e., the murderer, right?
<Bookpal> Well no, this story does not have a murderer, but a bad FBI agent
does try to kill her husband
<Casey> Anna and her husband are traveling around the U.S. when the
incidence occurs
<Bookpal> Yes, they are
<Casey> I was wondering after last meeting--has Anna ever lived on her own?
<Bookpal> No-country club type but now must pull herself together-this will
happen slowly so the reader pulls for her
<Bookpal> She will undergo big changes as the plot develops
<Casey> Okay.  Understand.  And the slow development works well then.
<Casey> It keeps her believable.
<Bookpal> Yes-gives her problems to overcome
<Zach> Just don't make the change too easy to come by.
<Bookpal> It won't be
<Casey> Does she have parents or children?
<Casey> in-laws?
<Bookpal> Children-grown
<Bookpal> No in-laws
<Casey> Do the children rally to her aid?
<Zach> What's her overpowering motivation?
<Bookpal> This is a "what-if" of an old case
<Bookpal> No, they don't
<Bookpal> Prove her hubby is not who the FBI thinks he is - after he is
arrested and she finds herself alone in another state
<Zach> Okay.  Good.
<Casey> Why is Anna not involving the children in what's happened to their
father?
<Bookpal> She tries, but they don't help - still working on that - it would
be too easy
<Casey> How many children are we talking about?
<Bookpal> It is a 30 year old FBI case that was not solved and he meets all
the criteria for being the right guy
<Bookpal> 2 boys
<Zach> Is this a fiction story?  Sorry if I'm asking a dumb question.
<Casey> I was thinking that 1 could have just gotten a new job and has no
leave time he can use to take off from work.
<Bookpal> Yes, but based on a true case - using my "what-if" thinking
<Bookpal> Good idea
<Soulmoon> I can see why the boys do not get invovled.  Most country club
type families push their children away to be with their social group.
<Bookpal> That's a good point Soulmoon
<Soulmoon> Thus, the boys think that their father was never there for them
so why should they be there for him.
<Bookpal> Keep going--I like it
<Soulmoon> me?
<Bookpal> yes
<Zach> IMO, those are rather weak motivations when you're talking a more or
less life and death situation.
<Zach> "Oh, Daddy never spent time with me, so I'll get him back by letting
him rot in Leavenworth."  At least make him a former abusive father or
something.
<Bookpal> It can be more complicated-but it gives me a starting point, if
it doesn't work I'll delete the kids
<Bookpal> lol, Zach
<Casey> They can be underlying resentments--which permits acceptance of
more rational / logical-seeming excuses
<Soulmoon> Actually, even though I don't know you Zach that's my life in a
way.
<Casey> Keep one--with a new job!
<Zach> No, I say keep them.  Make one a girl.  Have her accuse her father
of molesting her as a child (so she wants to see him rot), but maybe he
really didn't do it but she had a reason to think so or some other sinister
motive--and the brother could be trying to protect her.
<Bookpal> Good
<Zach> Thus when the mom asks for help they turn her down, separately for
their own reasons./
<Zach> But the girl child might not explain why.
<Casey> The girl could be on the verge of having a baby--the first
grandchild!
<Zach> Till later in the story.
<Bookpal> I have two teenage boys that find something that sets the FBI
investigation going
<Zach> The children, or other boys?
<Soulmoon> But anyway, I've seen children left in the streets because their
parents didn't want the kid after the other groups members went "OH MY GOD!
You have kids at your age, that's just wrong. You shouldn't have kids
they'll make you ugly."
<Bookpal> Others, and this couple get involved because of their contact
with the two teenagers
<Zach> Be careful of overpopulating your story.
<Bookpal> Soul-I know that is true. I took in a girl because of that
thinking by her mom
<Bookpal> Yes, I'm aware of that Zach, Thanks
<Zach> Also be careful of keeping too much to the truth of a true
story--they almost always make terrible fictional works, without major
trimming and shaping up.
<Bookpal> The only truth will be the dates of events in the original crime
<Zach> As they say, fiction has to make sense--real life seldom does.
<Zach> I think the backbone, as I understand it, is just fine.  Man is
arrested, leaving woman stranded and needing to get him out.
<Casey> What is/are Anna's weaknesses?
<Bookpal> FBI agent feels his career was ruined by this case and iS set to
kill if he has to
<Zach> Kill who?
<Bookpal> Never making decisions-spoiled by hubby
<Bookpal> the man arrested
<Casey> Won't murder REALLY ruin his career--and life?
<Zach> Why was his career ruined?  Didn't he get his man?
<Bookpal> That's right Zach-he didn't. Now he will no matter what
<Zach> I'm confused.
<Bookpal> lol
<Soulmoon> Don't stress Zach, so am I.
<Bookpal> Maybe you missed that this is a 30 year old case - never solved
<Zach> Okay, so the FBI agent arrests the guy he's convinced did it.  But
what, he knows it isn't the guy?  So why not let him go?
<Zach> So he's solved it now?  Why would his career now be ruined?
<Bookpal> The agent is psycho-I have a real agent helping me with the
profile of this guy
<Casey> If I've followed this correctly, agent is convinced this is the man
<Zach> If the woman proves her husband isn't the one?
<Zach> Okay, psycho agent.
<Zach> A word to the wise: psychotics are pretty much passe in today's
fiction markets.  They've really been beaten to death.
<Bookpal> He believes it at first, but does find out he isn't the right guy
so he is going to kill him to make himself look good.
<Soulmoon> I don't mean to interrupt but I'm not following and going to sit
out awhile.
<Casey> Does psycho agent now stand to get a promotion or raise for solving
this crime?
<Bookpal> No, it's just a vindication of his screw up in the beginning of
the case
<Bookpal> Soul, we can go on to something else
<Casey> I'm more concerned about the agent than Anna at this point.
<Soulmoon> no, you started so you should continue! never skip over it while
you're ahead. Nothing will ever be accomplished if you move on.
<Zach> A humble suggestion: make the FBI agent rather over the hill, drop
the psycho motivation but make him frustrated and desperate.  That should
be sufficient to put him over the edge.
<Casey> If he's willing to kill, just be certain that what he gains is
worth it to him, in his mind.  Beyond a doubt.
<Zach> Pension.
<Bookpal> That's what I planned Zach-just didn't explain it well
<Zach> "You screw this up, Bosworth, and your pension is history!"
<Casey> My thought--if this is a 30 yo case, agent must be close to
retirement.
<Zach> Right, Casey!
<Bookpal> He is - last chance
<Zach> Old psychos are pathetic.
<Bookpal> The real Agent who is advising me is helping me with what they do
with screwup agents instead of letting them go so it will be realistic
<Zach> Old desperate people are sympathetic, even while they're behaving
badly.
<Casey> Most people are cruising at that point---only waiting for
retirement and their pension--not willing to risk murder to screw up all
their plans.
<Bookpal> We are on a roll - thanks
<Zach> But what iF a hotshot section chief put the pressure on?
<Zach> Could change the whole face of things.
<Casey> Yep.
<Bookpal> The pressure will be on - this case is/was one of a kind and very
public
<Zach> Suppose the FBI was acquired in a leveraged buyout by the CIA.  They
have to trim staff to pay for it.  So the old agents are under pressure
from the young MBA agents, who want to fire them.
<Zach> I mean, this is PLAUSIBLE in our modern, corrupt society.
<Bookpal> It sure is
<Zach> (Sorry, I got off-track there.)
<Casey> The very public aspect helps with the sense of pressure he would be
under to save face.
<Bookpal> I would love to tell you because you will understand, but then
you might not be able to read it and give me good feedback
<Casey> We'll wait for the book, Bookpal.
<Casey> Okay, returning to Anna for a moment.  She is independently
wealthy, therefore she has the time and motivation to work on her husband's
release.  Right?
<Bookpal> Yes, but has never done anything in her life - she is stuck with
learning to drive a huge motor home, etc
<Bookpal> Not real wealthy
<Soulmoon> from what I gather she is not at home really and doesn't know
what to do by herself. 
<Bookpal> true and that is a subplot--her becoming strong
<Soulmoon> she like a rich person that has all her maids doing her work
like dressing and bathing.
<Bookpal> Not that far
<Soulmoon> close though?
<Bookpal> yes-hubby took very good care of her. She will go through some
doubts of his guilty/not guilty
<Soulmoon> that's good, it shows that she was caught up in the moment and
didn't think of what he could be doing to her like taking her money etc.
(maybe?)
<Bookpal> She wonders about the date of the crime, because her hubby was
away at that time. Bought a business later.
<Casey> What does she look like?
<Bookpal> Small, sophisticated - appearance changes as she is forced to
act.
<Casey> Explain that last?!
<Bookpal> Clothing, hair, ect. changes as she goes
<Bookpal> From whatever to jeans, tennis shoes, making her more mobile
<Casey> You mean, she's not so worried about breaking a nail or making sure
her hair's coifed--
<Casey> You answered before I finished!
<Soulmoon> say that a wheel blows ofF and she has to change it. . .if her
hair is long it get in the way so she cuts it off so it doesn't get in the
way and it's easier to manage.
<Bookpal> Right on - no time for beauty shops and spas
<Bookpal> Yes, that kind of thing
<Casey> I rather like the physical alteration paralleling her emotional
maturation and growth
<Bookpal> Yes, that happens at the same time. You are making me feel like I
have the right ideas.  Thanks
<Casey> Is there any other aspect of her situation you're hazy about that
we might be able to offer suggestions on?
<Bookpal> I can see this whole thing in my head, just getting it down is
the problem
<Casey> Yep, yep, yep!  That is the challenge of writing!
<Soulmoon> if you need my help just drop a line.
<Bookpal> That about covers it. I know I have to move her slowly. She has
to believe in her hubby and then tries to convince others and she realizes
what is happening with the agent
<Bookpal> Thanks, Soulmoon
<Bookpal> I plan to have a Z7 reading committee.
<Casey> Anyone wishing to be next victim?
<Minky5> ha... no way!
<Casey> Awwww, Minks!  Don't make me call your name.
<Minky5> shrinking down as far as possible...
<Casey> Zach, do you have a character you'd care to place under the
microscope?
<Zach> Uh, let me think about it.
<Minky5> I have a name and a goal, sketchy at best, I didn't exactly know
how this was all going to work tonight
<Casey> This was to be a brainstorming session.
<Casey> What's the name? 
<Minky5> Sandy, short for Cassandra
<Casey> Nice name.  What does Sandy wish to do?
<Minky5> she knows she is going back in time, evidence exists to that fact,
but she has to do without her asthma medications
<Casey> What will she accomplish by going back into time?
<Minky5> she has to pave the way for someone from that time to go forward
in time
<Minky5> getting to sound real hokey
<Bookpal> No, it doesn't
<Casey> Are they switching places, or will she be returning to her time
with this other person?
<Chipmonk> No, depends on how you handle it.
<Minky5> not switching places she will stay there
<Casey> It sounds interesting.
<Bookpal> Will she be without the medication because it does not exist in
that time?
<Minky5> you got it
<Casey> Knowing that it is risky to her life to do so?
<Minky5> like I said the evidence is there that she did go back so she must
survive
<Casey> Ah!  I didn't pick up on the "she's already done it" part.
<Bookpal> Does her survival depend just on her health condition?
<Minky5> loops and more loops
<Minky5> thinking...
<Soulmoon> just to insert a bit, i know people that have asthma or whatever
and didn't even know they had it so it is possible under some conditions
that you can survive without medication.
<Minky5> no... there is a subplot to make sure she doesn't succeed
<Bookpal> See ya, Zach
<Minky5> not with severe asthma
<Minky5> hubby has it, a good test case!
<Soulmoon> i must have missed you saying that part or something.
<Bookpal> I have severe asthma and I don't cross the street without my
stuff
<Minky5> no, I didn't say how severe Soulmoon
<Chipmonk> Were there alternatives to modern medicine in the time she is
going to visit?
<Casey> What family does Sandy leave behind, and won't they be putting out
missing person reports on her when she vanishes?
<Minky5> nebulizer... the whole bit
<Minky5> Civil War era chipmonk
<Minky5> to clarify... my hubby has severe asthma, using him as a "model"
<Bookpal> That is the time she is going to? Civil War?
<Chipmonk> And what is causing her asthma?  Could it be something in the
environment that wouldn't be there in 1860s?
<Minky5> polution is even worse then, coal dust etc.
<Chipmonk> Shall I ask gosh in?
<Casey> Sure, Chip
<Bookpal> good point, Minky
<Minky5> oh gosh no!
<Chipmonk> True, but different.  Don't forget all those horse droppings in
the streets.
<Bookpal> allergies were not understood as they are now
<Minky5> that's it exactly, they didn't even know about bacteria etc.
<Chipmonk> Bad air.  Miasmas.
<Minky5> their "cures" will nearly kill her
<Bookpal> Will she try to take care of herself using her knowledge
<Bookpal> Hot coffee does wonders!
<Minky5> knowing she is going back, she will have studied up on herbs etc.
but it's probably not enough
<Bookpal> good idea
<Minky5> that's what hubby's doc says bookpal!
<Bookpal> True
<Chipmonk> So, what is the one thing that makes her take the risk?
<Minky5> I have to replace theophylline...
<Minky5> azmacort
<Minky5> prednisone
<Casey> Coffee is one of the medicinal "herbs" in my medicinal herbs book.
<Bookpal> Yes, is the person she is replacing important to the world, etc.?
<Minky5> and albuterol
<Minky5> she not replacing the person, just making sure she gets to the
future
<Chipmonk> So what makes her decide to take the risk?
<Minky5> the woman who is coming forward is pregnant, it's the baby that is
important
<Chipmonk> What in her character makes her willing?
<Minky5> the one going back or forward?
<Minky5> loopy I know
<Chipmonk> Sandy.
<Minky5> the evidence is there in the future that she went back
<Minky5> no choice really
<Minky5> lost them all now...
<Chipmonk> What makes her believe it.  If she didn't want to go she'd find
an excuse not to believe the evidence.
<Casey> There needs to be an overriding necessity--even for her initial
decision to go back, which would still exist the second time she does it.
<Minky5> I haven't fleshed the whole thing out yet... maybe she has a child
of her own in that time...
<Minky5> meets her own decendents in the future
<Casey> The thought in my head is that somehow this unborn child is her
grandchild or some kind of blood relative
<Minky5> can't be her grandchild if she is going back to that same time...
<Minky5> she would have to go back even earlier for that to happen
<Chipmonk> Why would the reader care whether this child ends up in the 20th
century?
<Casey> But she has some knowledge or ability to transgress time.  Wouldn't
forward work as well as backward?
<Minky5> she has to make sure that those in the future are ready for the
other woman... Grace
<Chipmonk> Why?
<Casey> Then, are her relatives included in on the plot, so to speak, which
is why they aren't calling the police and having her picture posted on the
6:00 news as a medical alert, missing person?
<Minky5> the child will become president of the united states
<Casey> -Please don't make his last name be Clinton!!!
<Minky5> details, details...
<Minky5> no way! ;-)
<Chipmonk> Okay, Minky, that gives the reader as part of the population, a
reason to care.
<Minky5> the baby is a girl... 
<Casey> So, Sandy does have some foresight into the future!!!
<Minky5> there's a whole secret organization... government plot... whatever
<Casey> I was about to say that, Minky!
<Chipmonk> So does Sandy know that this child as president will resolve
some crisis or something?
<Casey> That Sandy must have some "in" with some really powerful people.
<Minky5> that's book two if there ever is a book one chipmonk
<Chipmonk> And why her?
<Chipmonk> Ah!
<shorty103> I'm a little lost here, can someone fill me in
<Casey> What would have happened if this particular girl-child had been
born in her natural era?
<Casey> we're doing the same thing that we were doing last meeting, Rose,
only this time, everyone can see each other.
<Minky5> well no woman would have been president in the 19th century
<Casey> We're working with Minky's character at the moment.
<Minky5> funny casey
<shorty103> okay, it's about time the icq acted right
<Minky5> working over Minky's character more like it
<shorty103> that sound interesting
<Casey> I have a character I'll let everyone abuse later.  Moderators are
not exempt!
<Minky5> goodie
<shorty103> great
<Casey> Crip is interested in him, so I was trying to wait until Crip
arrived before sacrificing Manerra.
<Minky5> I've lost the whole train of thought...
<Minky5> the whole thing needs work... but is it falling flat already?
<Casey> Minky, our questions aren't meant to rip your character to shreds,
only to give you some idea of the wonderment any reader may have should
they encounter your character and his/her situation.
<Minky5> oh I know... but it needs spark, a hook etc
<Casey> No, it's not falling flat.  As you said, this is a developing
character.
<shorty103> yes, that is what I'm working on too Mary
<Minky5> asthma adds a reason to care about her fate
<Casey> Hopefully, our questions will assist you in pinpointing the areas
that need further thought and development.
<Minky5> how does she cope etc
<Casey> It gives the reader something to root for-- and adds suspense.
<Minky5> and why does she stay behind
<Casey> Yes.  Why does she?
<Minky5> does writing software help or hinder? like the one from novalearn?
<Chipmonk> Never heard of it.
<shorty103> I could never make heads or tails of that software Mary
<Minky5> not really sure why she stays behind yet... balance of some sort
<Minky5> you can get a demo online
<Casey> I would think that the status and hardship imposed on women would
not be a comfortable position for her to be in after the freedoms and
status she enjoys here.
<Chipmonk> She can't just be a victim of circumstances.
<shorty103> what made her consider staying behind Mary
<Minky5> that struggle would definitely add to the plot too, frustrations
<Casey> That's why I asked if there must be a swap.  Sort of, filling in
the hole in time left by Grace's advance to the present.
<Chipmonk> She has to choose to do it for some good reason or the reader
will feel cheated.
<Minky5> that's what I meant by balance
<shorty103> sounds interesting, I hope you find that balance
<Minky5> Maybe she can't get forward again and is stuck
<Chipmonk> Being stuck isn't very satisfying to the reader.
<Casey> maybe--one of the little things about the time switch the
government forgot to mention during the recruitment?
<Minky5> the reasons are revealing themselves slowly... almost like real
life... does that happen when anyone else writes?
<Casey> Oh, yes!
<Minky5> ha ha casey
<Chipmonk> Yes, all the time.
<shorty103> or maybe she doesn't want to move forward due to something that
is happening
<Minky5> well then, I'll find that satisfying reason or change the plot!
<Chipmonk> Sometimes you think it should  go one way and the characters
take a completely different turn on you.
<Minky5> well she could fall in love
<shorty103> that is one of many roads to explore
<Casey> Love would not keep me in a subservient role, stuck in the past
with severe asthma.
<Chipmonk> There's one.
<Chipmonk> Could we brainstorm on this?
<Casey> Especially with the dangers of child birth, high infant mortality,
early death rate, etc.
<Casey> All things she would know.
<Casey> Sure, Chip!
<Minky5> but what if she can't go home again
<Chipmonk> Like everybody give a reason why you might get stuck in the
1860s.
<Casey> The time machine broke!
<shorty103> what about the things that she doesn't know or didn't until she
was told moments before the time shift
<Chipmonk> She finds a treatment for asthma, but can't take it back or it
would upset history.
<Minky5> no tacky time machine
<Minky5> good one chipmonk
<Chipmonk> She finds she has something else to do there and she belongs
there?
<Casey> If she can't go home again, then, yes, she would by necessity have
a desire to make as decent a life for herself as she could--once she
stopped wanting to kill people.
<Minky5> want to know what started this?
<Bookpal> Yes
<shorty103> I know I'm not much help considering what I  don't know about
the story
<Minky5> George Washington had no children...
<Chipmonk> What, Minky?
<Minky5> patience chip
<Minky5> his real birthday is Feb 22
<Minky5> in seventeen something or other eleven days are hacked off the
calendar
<Minky5> his birthday is now Feb11
<Chipmonk> Really?
<Minky5> 11 days of his life are missing
<Minky5> great ready made time warp
<Minky5> true story so far
<Casey> How neat!
<Minky5> look it up
<Bookpal> Cool
<shorty103> interesting
<Minky5> what happen in those 11 days...
<Chipmonk> But he really didn't miss eleven days.
<Casey> He would have gotten to live them twice.
<Bookpal> Good plot idea
<Minky5> love affair... children... maybe a better book than I'm working
on!
<Casey> So he was really 11 days older when he died than we give him credit
for.
<Chipmonk> Hmmm.
<Minky5> Grace's baby could be a descendent of Washington... nah... too
stupid a plot twist!!! I need sleep!
<Casey> This is brainstorming.  Everything's permitted.
<Bookpal> Never throw an idea out - just tuck it away, you might need it
<Chipmonk> Oh, how about if Sandy has information that is needed by the
union army or the war will go the other way?
<shorty103> no I don't think that idea bad, it might end up in the book ,
you never say never
<Casey> Oh, are you trying to say the South didn't win!!??!!
<Minky5> any thing is possible chip, I just want to know if the story is
worth saving and working on at this point!
<Chipmonk> Well, to Gosh it did.
<Chipmonk> And the extreme south lost.
<Minky5> huh? missing something somewhere...
<Chipmonk> And to Rose too.
<Casey> Oh no!  (Fanning myself and reaching for a mint julep)
<shorty103> yes, it could be, just give it a little time for the characters
  Mary
<Minky5> frankly my dear I don't give a damn... let's move on! ;-)
<Casey> Gosh is Canadian, Minky
<Chipmonk> Rose and Gosh are Canadian so the North is South of them.
<Minky5> got it!
<Goshwin> !  I am?? (checks ID.. )  well wada yah know.. I am!
<Chipmonk> Identity crisis alert!
<shorty103> what Gosh, you trying to confuse me again
<Minky5> another one of those posts that happen at the same time... now it
looks like I don't care about them being from the great north! argh!
<Casey> I know, you're accustomed to us calling you names.  You, you
Canuck!
<Goshwin> Ahem... humor...(shrug)
<shorty103> I don't like hockey, so Gosh is all by himself on that one
<Minky5> my poor characters!
<Bookpal> I thought Canuck was a westcoast Canadian :-)
<Goshwin> Actually I dont care much for it myself
<Chipmonk> We don't know what else to call him.
<shorty103> I'm east, fffffaaaarrrrr east of where Gosh is
<Minky5> in relation to Maine?
<Goshwin> east? how east <= I be Ontario
<shorty103> New Brunswick Mary
<Goshwin> Yep .. EAST.. more than 10 hours drive
<Chipmonk> She's a Mainiac, mainiac on the floor and she's dancin' like she
never danced bedfore.
<Minky5> oh yeah you said that last week... the kids will have been home
for 4 1/2 days the brain is fried
<shorty103> lol Chip
<Minky5> I remember that movie!
<shorty103> I have that movie
<Minky5> ok what's the name of it then...
<shorty103> along with 399 more movies
<shorty103> Flashdance
<Minky5> thank you would have bothered me all night
<shorty103> no prob
<Chipmonk> Oh, I thought that was the State song of Maine!
<Casey> Rose, would you like to present your character?  I understand
you've got a new one this week.
<shorty103> lol Chip
<shorty103> yes, I like to introduce Christina
<Casey> Therefore the strange spelling of mainiac
<Minky5> Maine's state song is some drinking song... not much else to do
here...
<Casey> Chuckling and shaking head
<Goshwin> Finally figured out the context of the comment
<Chipmonk> Tell us about Christina.
<Minky5> I GOT IT HONEST
<shorty103> well, I'm shy
<Casey> We'll help you.
<shorty103> will you
<Casey> What does Christina hope to accomplish?
<shorty103> well, she is trying to find herself, remembering that when she
was thirteen, she was told that she was adopted
<Casey> How old is she now?
<shorty103> nineteen
<Casey> Is she dissatisfied with her adoptive parents? 
<shorty103> she wants to find her birth mother, and no, she just wants to
see where she came from
<shorty103> find her roots
<Casey> Is she aware that her seeking might hurt the people who raised her?
<shorty103> yes, but they knew that  day would come
<Casey> Why did they tell her that she was adopted?  Was there a need to do
so?
<shorty103> they thought it was the right thing to do
<Casey> Why did they wait so long to tell her, then?
<shorty103> I really don't know, I was adopted, and that is the age that my
adopted parents told me, without any reason behind it
<Bookpal> How old were they?
<Chipmonk> So, why do we sympathize  or care about Christina as readers?
<shorty103> who Bookpal
<Bookpal> Your parents - maybe they were afraid you would never know
<Bookpal> That would make a good reason anyway
<Casey> Oh--like Christina's parents may be worrying about their
mortality--maybe increasing or serious health problems?
<Bookpal> Could work
<Casey> That would spur the desire to tell.
<shorty103> the things that happen to christina after she had begun her
search for her birth mother is what I'm writing about
<Chipmonk> Okay.
<Bookpal> sounds good
<shorty103> and to answer your question Boolpal, I really don't know my
parents age at that time
<Bookpal> ok
<shorty103> my theme is to show what ever life has to dish out, there is
always hope for a better future
<Chipmonk> So is Christina's story the same as what happened to you or is
it fictionalized?
<shorty103> a little of both
<Casey> Remember, Rose, that the story you are writing, while based on your
life, does not need to follow the actual facts, and sometimes it would be
better served not to.
<shorty103> yes, I am learning that
<Bookpal> I agree
<Casey> And for those things you don't know, make something up, and have
reasons for what happens in your story.
<Chipmonk> Real life usually has too many boring parts and not enough of a
plot.
<shorty103> but I also have to get these feeling out in some way, so I feel
that it is necessary to put a little of both
<Casey> Then you're doing exactly what you need to be doing.
<Bookpal> That's why writing helps. You draw on your feelings without
having to follow facts
<Casey> And without being constrained by the facts.
<shorty103> so by putting my story within another story, I can accomplish
both at the same time
<Casey> Yes.
<Chipmonk> You can also deal with what you wish would have happened or what
you're glad didn't happen.
<Casey> Actually, I would think that you're disguising your story within a
fictional story.
<shorty103> yes, I hadn't looked at that way, thank you
<shorty103> I think that is why I'm asking my sister for her imput, to help
fill in some of the spots that she remembers too!
<Casey> Tell us something more about Christina as a person
<Casey> She's 19
<Casey> I know Amy and Rosa
<shorty103> she's 19
<Casey> Where does she fit into the story?
<Casey> Or is she in a different story?
<shorty103> well, Christina is the one that is searching for her birth
mother, while Rosa and Amy are part of the other story
<shorty103> anyone confused yet
<Casey> Okay!  I just didn't want to get too confused.
<shorty103> okay
<Casey> Is she on her own?  What kind of job does she have?
<Bookpal> By other story do you mean what happens while she is searching?
<Casey> Or is she in school?
<shorty103> but what I want to show, is that by telling Christina's story,
Amy can learn a lesson and her grand mother a little better
<Casey> Is Amy adopted, too?
<shorty103> no
<Casey> what lesson will be learned then?
<shorty103> but there is conflict within Amy home, and that is why she is
with her grand mother's for the summer
<shorty103> I am still working on that question Casey
<Bookpal> Are Amy and Christina related? I think I missed something maybe
<Casey> Okay!  As long as you're aware of it and working on it, that's
fine.
<shorty103> no, Christina is a character that Rosa has written about in
order to tell her story
<Casey> So Christina is actually Rosa?
<shorty103> but both Rosa  and Christina are me
<Bookpal> Got it
<shorty103> and yes Casey
<Casey> Got it!
<Casey> Now I'm very clear on what's going on.
<shorty103> I felt I had to do it that way, so there wasn't to much
confusion
<shorty103> does that make any sense
<Casey> Still, by developing Christina, you are in effect developing Rosa
as a character as well.
<shorty103> yes
<Casey> So all these questions about Christina are important.
<shorty103> yes
<Casey> (Wish I could take care of 2 characters at once!  How clever!)
<Bookpal> No kidding
<shorty103> well, I didn't know what else to do
<Casey> You did good!
<shorty103> thank you
<Bookpal> yes, you did
<shorty103> I know with the help of all of you and my sister, and cousin, I
will get it worked out and written
<Bookpal> remember we are available by email if you get stuck
<Casey> so, where is Christina in her life:  in college?  Working a job?
<shorty103> thank you
<shorty103> no, she was working long enough to buy the things that she
needed for her new adventure
<Bookpal> Are you going to put her in danger, create problems for her
during her search, etc.?
<Casey> has she located her biological mother then?
<Casey> At least an address, that is.
<shorty103> yes Casey, and the only danger she faced was one of abuse,
mental and physical
<Casey> Is she escaping the abuse, or going toward it?
<shorty103> she moved into it at the beginning, and over time of a year and
half, grew to understand what was going on and got out of it
<Casey> Understand.
<shorty103> I have grown because of that experience too!
<Bookpal> are we talking boyfriend or adoptive parents as abusers
<shorty103> boyfriend
<Bookpal> ok
<shorty103> and his mother
<Casey> I was thinking about foreshadowing, and how that could be achieved
before Christina arrives at her birth mother's house.
<Bookpal> brother!
<shorty103> I don't understand Casey, and there was no brother
<Bookpal> No, I meant " how awful"
<Casey> But maybe the contrast will be her anticipation (exaggerated
wonderfulness), vs. the true situation she discovers.
<Casey> foreshadowing are hints of what is about to happen.
<shorty103> it was Christina 's boyfriend and the boyfriend's mother, that
was abusing Christina and her birth mother which lived under the same roof
<Minky5> gosh... look at the time... I've got to go...
<Casey> glad you could make it, Minky.
<Casey> come back again.
<Bookpal> Bye, Minky
<Casey> Goodnight
<Minky5> pleasure... same time in two weeks?
<Bookpal> Keep writing
<Casey> yep
<shorty103> I don't see how foreshadowing would work in this story Casey
<shorty103> I am working on some different things to bring to light
Christina's story, but it might take a little thinking and planning
<Bookpal> Always does - that's the hard part, making it all fit
<Casey> Foreshadowing would work from the time of Christina's experience of
the abuse until she leaves--giving the reader the anticipation that she
wants to leave and eventually will.
<shorty103> yes that is so true Boolpal
<shorty103> yes I can see that would work, in that part of the story
<Bookpal> and in mysteries you have to throw in those darn clues
<shorty103> yes
<shorty103> I'll just have to work at it to fit it in
<Casey> Yep.  Can't commit a crime without 'em
<Bookpal> lol
<Casey> Don't force them.  they should come naturally--like after he's hit
her, she is looking through the phone book and notices the number for a
help line.
<Casey> Maybe she doesn't call that day, but the memory of the number
remains
<Casey> That sort of thing.
<shorty103> well, no one really dies, but my birth mother did die the very
day I left that house and the abuse
<shorty103> understood Casey
<shorty103> my birth mother was only 48 when she past away
<shorty103> but she looked ninety
<Bookpal> How sad
<shorty103> now that is true
<Casey> Indeed!
<shorty103> I only knew her for a year
<Chipmonk> At least you did get to know her.
<Bookpal> Yes, I hope that helped
<Casey> Do either of you, Bookpal or Rose, worry about possible law suits
should a character recognize him/herself as the person he/she represents?
<shorty103> she was underfed, and wasn't really looked  after by the
doctors either, and yes it did Bookpal
<Bookpal> NO, already discussed it with an attorney
<Casey> Good.
<Bookpal> I'm glad, Shorty
<shorty103> well, it took place back in 1978 -80,
<Casey> I've read warnings about the dangers of representing real cases,
where the actors could be identified with real people.
<shorty103> I am trying to avoid that by dressing up the characters
<Casey> It's generally a good idea to change locations, too--or invent a
fictitious city or town.
<shorty103> to make them look like anyone could have been those people
<Chipmonk> Another reason why not to tell it as it really happened.
<Bookpal> I did find out if you are going to say bad things about a
business, etc. change the name - if good things they love the publicity
<Casey> Exactly, Bookpal.
<Bookpal> A friend sold his mystery, and he is a lawyer, he changed the Red
Lion Hotel to Black Lion -
<shorty103> I've changed the names of the people already, but I can go just
a little further, but I want their personalities to stand out
<Chipmonk> A friend of mine got a letter from Crayola because she used
their name without the trademark symbol,
<Bookpal> That is serious - they always talk about that in Writer's Digest
<Chipmonk> In an obsure little humor piece in an obsure magazine.
<Casey> And they emphasize, getting the name exactly right!
<shorty103> I am keeping all of this in mind when I write
<Casey> Even down to whether or not a company puts a comma between their
name and Inc. or not.
<Chipmonk> Well, guy, I am falling asleep at the wheel.
<Bookpal> It helps keep the product from becoming generic. Like everyone
says Kleenex even though they mean tissue
<shorty103> yes, I do get the picture
<Goshwin> Ditto... getting late for me now..
<Bookpal> It is late for you guys
<Casey> Over something like that, I would think Kleenex would be thrilled
with the word-of-mouth publicity!
<Casey> Will see you later, Chip!  thanks for your help tonight.
<Bookpal> They're not
<Casey> crip, did you come with a character, or do you want to pick on
Manerra for a while?
<crip> uh
<crip> i'll pick on i guess
<Casey> You want to pick on Manerra?
<crip> letting my mood decrease after getting yelled at in a grocery store
line
<Casey> Just nod.  I know it's late for you, too.
<Casey> You weren't smoking in line, were you?!  (Gasp!)
<crip> no
<crip> i went to pay for my magazine
<Bookpal> Customer or clerk?
<Casey> Poking the person in front of you?
<crip> when this woman asks me if i have a discount card
<crip> a cashier lady
<crip> i tell her i don't and ask her if i get the 10 percent off like the
sign says above the newstand
<crip> perfectly nice, not mean at all
<crip> she starts yelling
<crip> ONLY IF YOU HAVE A DISCOUNT CARD! DO YOU HAVE ONE!
<Casey> Oh, she was in the wrong!
<crip> I quietly say no and hand her my money
<crip> she mutters how she can't believe i don't have a discount card
<Bookpal> I would have given her the magazine, too
<crip> i should have complained. i don't need that.
<Bookpal> Ask for the manager and hold up the line - it's great
<Casey> She should have offered to give you a discount card, or the
application for one!
<crip> i should have. book. i'll remember for the next time.
<crip> she didn't even offer one.
<crip> she just yelled.
<Casey> She's a moron, Crip.  don't let her get to you.
<crip> i know she is and i'm not
<crip> sorry
<crip> So....
<crip> where are my new chapters???? huh? huh? huh?
<Casey> being written and worked on!
<crip> work faster!!!! *L* *cracks whip*
<Casey> So, enters Manerra . . . 23 at this time in life, and his goal is
NOT to become temple ruler.
<Bookpal> I'm cutting out a lot of my outside activities so I can get back
to serious writing.
<Casey> That's what I'm trying to do, Bookpal.
<Bookpal> It's hard
<Casey> Yep.  too many obligations.
<crip> i'll have lots of time this week since i got squat for hours this
week
<Casey> Grin.  Wanna edit the chapters for me???!!!
<Bookpal> He is suppose to inherit the ruler job?
<crip> um lemme think
<crip> YES
<Casey> Yep.  He's the only successor.
<Bookpal> ok
<crip> who was ruler before he?
<Casey> At 15, he decided he didn't want the job.
<Casey> Aya.
<crip> is that person in the story?
<Casey> Aya was much older than Manerra.
<Casey> Not in the one you're reading.
<Casey> He's there only by reference--people talking about him.
<crip> oh
<crip> is he in any part of the stories?
<Casey> Oh yes!!!
<Casey> He's paramount in the first book--Moons' Kiss
<Bookpal> So have they been without a ruler for awhile?
<Bookpal> Good title
<crip> oh how silly of me since i've never seen the book!!!!!!
<crip> *L*
<Casey> There has not been a break in rulers in decades.
<Casey> there isn't now.
<Casey> Yet.
<crip> so it's just one after the other?
<Casey> Yes.  Sometimes two or three in waiting, but rarely.
<crip> oh so is there ever treachery with people who are waiting and wish
to be that?
<Casey> Raena is Manerra's successor, but it's unusual in that Aya died the
evening Raena was born.
<Casey> Not usually,  but there is lots of plotting and treachery by those
who wish they had that position or want a piece of the power.
<crip> ah i see
<Bookpal> ok
<crip> more of a how will the empire be run sort of thing?
<Casey> Am not sure I understand your question?  You mean, like the council
member positions, and the tribal leader positions--all the other positions
people can hold besides temple ruler?
<Bookpal> Is he the ruler now and wants out or trying not to get there
<crip> yeah
<crip> chain of command
<Casey> Trying not to get there, but that doesn't work.  He ends up with
the position.
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> His way out, tho, is to hand over much of his power to the ruling
council.
<Casey> His reluctance to rule foreshadows what he eventually does.
<Bookpal> Your leaving me hanging.....what does he do? Is this a hook?
<Casey> I was trying to stick only with Manerra, but there are plots within
plots in my writing.
<Bookpal> You are
<Bookpal> ok
<Bookpal> Give us his background
<Bookpal> Personality, etc
<Casey> His sole purpose is to keep a coalition of tribes from waging war
on each other and the foreigners who have entered the region.
<Casey> He's somewhat impulsive.  He's young (15) when Moons' Kiss begins.
<Bookpal> He can't do that and be a ruler?
<Casey> He's on the verge of taking the rites that will guarantee the line
of succession falls to him.
<Bookpal> at 15 or 23?
<Casey> But everything did not go as planned in his upbringing.  His mother
was supposed to have turned him over to Aya when he was 2 and she did not.
<Casey> On his 16th birthday is when he was to take the rite.
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> Aya had to track across the dessert to find him and take him back.
<Bookpal> ahh
<Casey> Meanwhile, Manerra's stepfather is attempting to bend the child to
his bidding.  Tackta is power hungry
<Casey> Aya finally corners them and gets Manerra back when he's 5 years
old.
<Casey> Manerra has memories of Tackta's beatings--both of his mother and
of himself.
<Bookpal> Is this sort of like a Dahli Llama type thing?
<crip> so is Aya the god one?
<Casey> Somewhat.  Religion is very important.  Especially specific rites.
<Casey> Yes, aya is a demigod.
<crip> ok
<crip> so a demigod can die i take it?
<Casey> Absolutely!
<Casey> This isn't fantasy.
<Casey> I write realistic--whatever it is.
<crip> so are there any actually gods in the story?
<Casey> Yep.  Acrahh is their principle god, Crysus is his consort.
<crip> ok
<Casey> Acrahh is the father of all the temple rulers.
<crip> oh i see
<Casey> (Adultery among the gods?!!)
<crip> are they very old or just immortal?
<Bookpal> back
<Casey> they are . . . gods!  One can't kill a god.
<Casey> The gods existed before the world was created.
<crip> oh. just verifying that a god can't be killed. i've heard of gods
being destroyed thats why i asked
<Casey> How do they do that?
<Casey> Usually gods are simply replaced by newer gods.
<Bookpal> In a power struggle?
<crip> thats what it usually is: replacement by another god or a person
rocketed to godlike status
<Casey> Then, they're
<Casey> '"deworshipped?"
<Bookpal> I see
<Casey> I'm wondering!
<Casey> Interesting idea.
<Casey> Anyway, back to the story . . .   Where was I?
<Casey> Other questions?
<Bookpal> not yet
<Bookpal> I do have a question
<Casey> What?
<Bookpal> In this type of writing do you know everyone's past, even if it
is not used in the story?
<Casey> I know much more than I ever use in a story, but not everyone does.
<Bookpal> So do I - so I was wondering
<Casey> I know the person who midwifed Manerra's birth and her whole story.
<Casey> I know his education, his family, even distant, etc.
<Bookpal> Man, that's a lot of thinking
<crip> ooooooh so many side stories
<crip> and we're left to suffer!!!!!!!!
<Casey> It helps immensely in making the story move.
<Bookpal> I think it would be hard to create so much - in other worlds, so
to speak
<Casey> I don't have to wonder what someone would do or why they would do
something.  I know.
<Bookpal> That helps - and it doesn't have to follow the real world
<Casey> And my story does take place on another world, and I know the
history of that world from its inception.
<crip> good for references in the future i take it
<Bookpal> Good golly, I admire you
<crip> all hail, casey~ *L* yeah right
<Casey> Well, this particular series I've been working on for 5 years, and
when I can't write, I'm working out histories, characters, plot
complexities, etc.
<crip> even if she is very talented
<crip> wow
<Casey> Does that hail get me respect?  Heck no!  Forget it.
<Bookpal> That's beyond my little brain
<crip> he he
<Bookpal> especially now that I'm blond! :-)
<Casey> I love it.  It's exhilarating when I solve a major dilemma.
<Casey> Or realize something about one of my tribes that fits in perfectly
with everything already invented and helps explain something else I'd
overlooked.
<crip> so in other words by the time the entire history is done and all the
stories have been told everyone will be dead and buried
<Bookpal> lol
<crip> except me because i will always look seventeen but you'll be buried
with the final pages in an unmarked grave to torture me
<Bookpal> rofl
<Casey> Yep!  Those were my exact instructions to Harold!  How did you
know?
<Bookpal> crip's writing talent should include comedy
<crip> how many tribes are there? or are there too many to count?
<crip> he tells me in our secret meetings
<Casey> Shurrang, Ringgangley, Kitarin, Ofrann, and the new guys are Yumen.
<Bookpal> WHERE do you get these names?
<crip> *flipping through handy reference guide*
<Casey> Made 'em up!
<crip> oh wait there is none...
<crip> uh
<crip> ok
<Casey> We need to invent an "Aliens Names" book, just like all the baby
names books. 
<Casey> There's another project to make us millionaires!
<Bookpal> I have a book I can loan you - "Beyond Jennifer and Jason" that's
what I use for names
<crip> *LOL* i'll tell, zen! that will be your next project!
<Bookpal> You won't believe how many people check out baby name books - we
even have pet name books
<Casey> Oh, no! 
<Casey> See, the market is ripe for our Aliens book!
<Bookpal> I think you should go for it
<crip> because there are no more original names
<Casey> I'd rather check one out of the library than buy one!
<Bookpal> Suggestions for book titles would be a good one, too.
<Casey> Then we'll be seeing babies with names like Snapenoffaglass
<Bookpal> LOL
<Casey> Mark my words!
<Casey> Kindergarten teachers will be going nuts!
<Bookpal> I had a young mother come in with her new baby - name Topanga -
she watches too much TV
<crip> hey if willow, zoe, or zelda is the norm than anything is possible
<Bookpal> Can you imagine school computer spell checkers
<Casey> The dog next door is named Zoe!
<crip> or tess *L*
<Casey> Can you imagine the spell checker on my stories?!  It is a major
headache.
<Bookpal> I know a five year old named Zoe
<Bookpal> Hope you can program it
<crip> oh c'mon manerra might be really manuel *L*
<Casey> It has an "add word to dictionary" feature, but that doesn't seem
to make it permanent in the dictionary it uses.
<Bookpal> Um, mine does.
<Casey> yeah, if someone tries to kill him, I'm sure he'll be happy to
become Manuel.
<crip> yeah mine does too. what torture have you put your poor pc through?
<Casey> then I'll go back to grumbling at this silly WP program!
<Bookpal> Word Perfect?
<Casey> Maybe I'm doing something wrong.
<Casey> Nope, Microsoft Word
<crip> what year version?
<Bookpal> That's what I have - Word from Office 97
<Casey> Oh, Crip!  Ask me Manerra's uncle's name instead!
<crip> i liked 95 better than 97 for some reason
<Casey> I don't have 97, so it must be 95??
<crip> does Manerra have any children?
<Bookpal> What happened to his mother?
<Casey> He can't.  That's against the law.
<crip> oh
<Bookpal> So....is that what he does later?
<Casey> She's still alive and around but she knows better than to get
anywhere near him.  In fact, she's had another baby since he was born.
<Bookpal> Does he know her?
<crip> who his mother?
<Casey> He has memories of her.
<Casey> yes, Manerra's mother.
<Bookpal> ok
<crip> so does he ever meet his brother?
<Casey> His mother's name is Matera.
<crip> half brother
<Bookpal> Do you plan a family tree in the back of the book
<Casey> And then I met a woman named Mattera--who wants to read the book
when it's finished because her name is in there.
<Casey> Matera has a daughter.
<Bookpal> Cool
<Casey> No, he doesn't.
<crip> oh sorry sister or half sister
<crip> oh man
<crip> wheres the fun in that?
<crip> poor headless manerra
<Casey> The fun is that Hyran's made the claim that Acrahh appeared to him
in a vision and that any child born after a shecaren's birth is "the
blessed of Acrahh' and must be given a position of power either on the
ruling council or somewhere higher.
<crip> watching Star Wars to get me motivated to write anything tomorrow
<crip> oh so manerra is that child?
<Casey> And wow, golly, gee, he just happens to fall within that category!
<Casey> Nope, manerra is a full-fledged shecaren.
<Casey> His power is undisputed.
<crip> so who is the kid?
<Casey> Matera's daughter!  Hyran is one.  Myra is another.
<crip> oh duh *smacks self in head*
<Casey> Hyran marries Myra, who's old enough to be his mother, just to
solifiy that claim to powr.
<crip> oh so i take it that is another story in itself?
<Casey> It's a subplot.  Hyran and Myra are the "bad guys."
<Bookpal> oh
<crip> *scratches head* hmmm
<Casey> Some of this stuff only comes out in a single sentence somewhere.
<Casey> As I said, there's a lot I know that is not used.
<crip> all the more reason for a speedier production!!!!!!!!!
<Casey> But all of these things gives firm motivation to each character who
is important to the plot and story.
<crip> as far as I'm concerned Valdyne should just beat them all up. *L*
<Casey> Zen hates Valdyne!
<Casey> Even called him names
<Bookpal> Why?
<crip> GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
<crip> nobody messes with Valdyne and lives!!!!!!!
<Casey> Zen thinks he's a power grubbing moron
<Bookpal> lol
<Casey> Crip, we haven't given you an opportunity to present your
character.
<Casey> Do you have one?
<crip> nope
<Casey> Want to invent one on the spot and we will breath life into him?
<crip> are you sure you want to do that?
<crip> and boy is it getting late i wouldn't want to keep you both up
<Casey> Only Bookpal's psychotic agent wanted to kill anyone tonight.
<Casey> I'm proud of you guys!
<crip> psychotic agent?
<Casey> Oh, you missed that part!
<Bookpal> yep, he did
<Casey> She was exceedingly brave.  She went first tonight.
<crip> i was late and only got in during the whole Rose thing
<crip> really? cool
<crip> ok i have a character if you two want to help me with him
<Bookpal> go, crip
<Casey> Great!
<Casey> So, fill in the blanks:  Character's name ____________
<crip> ok ok gimme a sec here
<crip> The character's name is Brom Friar.
<crip> ahhh spelled wrong
<crip> no wait
<crip> thats right
<crip> ok
<Casey> that's okay.  We don't know any differently
<Casey> He he actually a Friar?
<crip> not at all
<Casey> And what villainous thing must he be able to do in life?
<crip> he used to be the town hero of sorts but one day they all turned on
him so he moved away to overlook a small farm outside of town
<crip> after feeling betrayed this character has turned almost completely
neutral
<Casey> So we must decide 2 things immediately:
<Bookpal> I'm hooked - what happened
<crip> ok
<Casey> what did he do to become a hero,
<Casey> and what happened that everyone turned against him.
<crip> yes
<crip> the first part is very defined that
<crip> is why the second part is the story
<Casey> Do you have answers to either of these questions?
<crip> he has no idea why they started treating him badly all of a sudden
and it has to do with a number of things
<crip> it is a mystery
<Casey> Rumors!
<crip> in a way
<Bookpal> a mystery story or a mystery to him?
<Casey> Gossip!  That's what did it!
<crip> both
<crip> gossip is part of it
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> So he is trying to discover the reason for the turnabout?
<crip> well
<crip> he does want to discover it after finding a reason to be on either a
good or bad side but deciding whether to care either way
<crip> if that makes any sense
<Bookpal> what did he do to become a hero to this town?
<Casey> It makes sense.
<crip> various things. ummm...helping the town defend itself, building it
in a way
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> My hesitation is, that unless the internal conflict is hot and
heavy, a character cannot afford to be indecisive.
<crip> until one day a stranger shows up at his house and says he can
either keep his house if he doesn't meddle in an overtaking group's affairs
or to leave forever
<Casey> Threats!   Good!
<crip> however the stranger does it deliberately which is another part of
the story
<Bookpal> what would make him believe this stranger? Something in his past
<Casey> Good point, bookpal.
<crip> he has heard rumors of such things happening in town of threats and
so forth
<Casey> Did he show ID that Brom later checked up on and found to be
concrete?
<crip> he sees it happening to other towns so why not that one
<Bookpal> What time period do you have in mind?
<crip> medievil times
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> Oooohhh!  Scratch my ID thing.
<crip> fantasy basically
<crip> ID?
<Casey> (Turns head around.  Looks in right direction)
<Bookpal> ok - that opens up lots of possibilities
<Casey> ID, as in, see post above that one.)
<crip> oh i see
<Bookpal> You need ID is my stuff, Casey
<Casey> We needed to have asked that question sooner.
<crip> i may be confoosed what is ID?
<Casey> Funny how we make assumptions.
<Bookpal> idenification - like a badge for a cop
<Casey> Identification card.
<crip> oh i see
<crip> yes the stranger has ID
<crip> he he
<Bookpal> lol
<Casey> Like, a very long, heavy sword?
<Bookpal> What? A gold sword
<crip> no
<crip> Brom has no reason to doubt what he shows him
<Bookpal> ok
<crip> as identification
<Casey> Okay.  that's cool.
<crip> have a few ideas on that nothing concrete yet
<Casey> Bookpal!  Get back inside your own head and stay out of mine!
Please.
<crip> psychic Nw's *L*
<Bookpal> I like it there
<crip> yeah it's warm and soggy
<Bookpal> lol
<Casey> Thank you.  Then you be the typist and I'll just think.
<crip> *L* no way
<Casey> (he he he!  I love it!  A secretary!)
<crip> we don't need two caseys
<Bookpal> Hey, wouldn't that be great - for writing
<crip> oh the humanity!!!!
<Bookpal> We wouldn't need a modem
<Casey> Yes.  I'd get a whole lot more writing done than I do now.
<Casey> Let's see, before we had soggy brains, we had an ID crisis.
<Casey> That's solved.
<Casey> Moving on.
<Casey> What does saving a town look like? 
<Bookpal> Where will he go - will he try to come back
<Casey> Is that like posting "Save the Whale" stickers on the rumps of
mules?
<Bookpal> lol
<crip> look like?
<crip> he has a few leads he wants to check out that will determine whether
he goes back or not
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> What concrete actions has/is he doing to save the town?
<crip> he isn't doing anything to save the town now...he is wondering
whether it will be worth his time to save them or not
<crip> it's a moral dilemma
<Bookpal> or maybe if they deserve to be saved
<Casey> He sounds like a mage type person.
<Bookpal> mage?
<crip> really? more of a bounty hunter type
<Casey> magical-type person.
<Bookpal> ok
<crip> quiet big large person
<Casey> Okay!  I'm getting a clearer picture of him.
<crip> could snap someones head off with a flick
<crip> intelligent but doesn't really depend on it
<Casey> (both hands raise to throat.   Shifts uncomfortably)
<crip> more on intimidation
<Bookpal> Can he handle confrontation or is that why he will leave?
<crip> he wants a confrontation but the people suddenly ignored him
altogether.
<Bookpal> ok
<crip> why he left, he could get no answers
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> So there is definitely something afoot.
<crip> definitely
<Bookpal> What kind of people live in this town - workers, or ....
<crip> yes lots of workers a few politicians
<Bookpal> ok
<Casey> The take-over is to do what?
<crip> another mystery
<Casey> Supply goods to . . . someone? 
<crip> the people think one thing when it is something else altogether
<Casey> Are only certain people being displaced?
<crip> more of a self supporting town
<crip> easy pickings so no one will miss them
<crip> no one is being displaced in that particular town except for Brom
because he is the only threat to the enemy so far
<Casey> Brom is considered 'easy pickings?' 
<Casey> That was my wonder!
<Casey> Answered.  thank you.
<crip> no, thats why they want him as far away as possible
<Bookpal> Have you been thinking about this story crip or is it just coming
out now?
<Casey> Now you get out of my head!  It's getting crowded in there.
<crip> last fifteen minutes book *L* seriously
<crip> i know it needs to be more organized
<Bookpal> It's great that you have a good understanding of the idea
<Casey> Yeah!  It sounds as if you've given much more than 15 mins. thought
to this story.
<Bookpal> This fits in with what we talked about - knowing backgrounds that
might not make it to the story
<crip> thanks but it just sort of popped there
<crip> your questions have really helped
<Bookpal> um, maybe it was rumbling around for awhile
<crip> *L* maybe
<Casey> Want to trade brains?  I like yours better than mine.
<crip> no thanks
<crip> *LOL*
<Casey> Darn!  foiled again!
<crip> he he
<Bookpal> Brainstorming does help - gets you thinking and coming up with
story decisions
<crip> it really does
<Casey> Besides, it's fun.
<Bookpal> True
<crip> yup
<Bookpal> I do it all the time, not just in writing, and it drives people
nuts
<crip> really?
<Casey> Too many people are accustomed to thinking narrowly, not broadly.
<Bookpal> Yes, some people don't get the idea that it is just throwing
ideas out and then doing something with them if you can
<Casey> Questioning them would make them nuts.
<crip> ah
<Casey> I'm curious about Brom.  All this power and strength and yet a lack
of confidence in himself--or so it seems.
<Bookpal> People are not very flexible these days
<crip> it's not really a lack of confidence he just closes himself off for
so long after trusting these people he doesn't know how to feel
<Bookpal> Yes, Casey. Give him a reason, crip
<Bookpal> Good, crip!!!
<Casey> Good understanding of human nature.
<Bookpal> self-isolation could do that
<Casey> But something must happen to make him feel again--and to act.
<Casey> something that touches him deeply.
<crip> it does
<Casey> Some injustice.
<Casey> Or some threat to something he loves
<crip> when the stranger threatens him he uses a secret only Brom knows
that would destroy his credibility for a very long time
<Bookpal> good, crip
<crip> it's a little complicated and i do need to work the kinks out
<Casey> You've got an excellent start.  Keep going
<Bookpal> no problem - you just started
<crip> thanks i'm trying *L*
<Casey> To side-track you for a minute.  Did you ever name the sea story?
<crip> are you really psychic? i was just going to mention that
<Bookpal> scary, huh?
<crip> i need to work on that as soon as my printer is repaired
<crip> was going to print out and edit but the thing went screwy
<Casey> Why not?  We've been mind hoping all night long.
<Bookpal> You sound like me - I edit better from hard copy over computer
screen
<crip> indeed
<Casey> me, too!
<Bookpal> must be the red pencil from school days
<crip> my crit person is probably ready to kill me after all the effort
that person put into it which i don't blame them *L*
<Casey> It's all those inviting blank margins and extra blank lines.
<Bookpal> True
<Casey> Not so!  the crit person might just be curious.
<Casey> I mean, your crit person might herself be a very slow writer.
<Bookpal> When I'm working on the first draft I use the highlighter in
Word. Each color tells me to go back and do something
<Bookpal> I take it you are the crit person, Casey?
<Casey> I still write first drafts with a pen on paper. 
<Casey> Looking from side to side.  Do I have to answer Bookpal's question?
<Bookpal> I use the PC but have to print and go over it
<Bookpal> no
<crip> my crit person is a mean slobbering drunk of a person that is
certainly not casey
<crip> old battleaxe of a sagging human flesh oddity
<Casey> Thank you, Crip.  I didn't want to say so myself.
<Bookpal> Oh! Sorry, Casey
<Bookpal> How did that happen?
<crip> bad lottery drawing
<Casey> lol!
<Bookpal> One of us?
<crip> it was either zen in a foul mood or that waste of life
<crip> i picked the waste
<Bookpal> lol
<Casey> I'm certainly glad that I'm not ever talking to your crit person
again.
<crip> me too
<Bookpal> Alright guys - I need to know who - will not sleep if I don't
<crip> they aren't a part of nw any longer
<crip> went by the name of phycic
<Casey> It's not likely that you'll ever get that person to crit anything
you've written.
<crip> be thankful
<Bookpal> I hope not
<crip> badgers me all the time unless i fix my errors
<Bookpal> Did this someone leave about the time I joined up?
<crip> yes
<Casey> Even insists that you use accurate punctuation!  How awful!
<Casey> I mean . . . really!
<crip> they don't have the patience to interact with others
<Bookpal> Are you still working with them?
<crip> i have to
<Bookpal> Why?
<crip> i promised i would until the piece was finished
<crip> had some good ideas but the temper is a little too much sometimes
<crip> swore a lot at me but i learned to ignore
<Bookpal> Gees, crip. Life is too short for that
<crip> yeah i know
<Casey> For shame, for shame!  This is rumor mongoring.  We need to move
on.
<Bookpal> What is the worst thing that would happen if you told them to get
lost?
<crip> i can't believe book is believing a word of this
<crip> oops
<crip> *LOL*
<Bookpal> WHAT???
<crip> i can't help it i'm laughing too hard
<crip> casey is the mean slobbering drunk
<Casey> Bookpal, you've been had by the very worst critter NW's has
produced.
<crip> YEAH!
<crip> evil me
<Bookpal> Tears are running down my face!!! Here I was soooooo concerned
<crip> i'm sorry, book, i feel terrible
<crip> well not really
<crip> sort of
<Casey> And the worst that can happen to him is that he'll be absolutely
homeless if and when his folks throw him out on the street.
<Casey> Don't believe him!  He's still laughing!
<crip> not true, i have a table to live under at caseys home
<Bookpal> I'm lucky I went to the girls room a few minutes ago or I would
have a bigger mess than popcorn - laughing that hard can be dangerous
<Casey> I meant, if you told me to go jump.
<Casey> Now, aren't you glad you joined us tonight?
<Bookpal> I'm glad I chose to say "get lost" that was not my first thought
<Casey> Where else could you be tormented for free except here?
<Bookpal> It's great
<crip> see what happens when you threaten us with evidence? *L*
<Bookpal> Guess who WILL save the buffer now
<crip> i have to hand it to my cohort in crime, casey, who did a wonderful
job
<Casey> Yeah, but people who hang around with us too much could develop
nervous habits, like always looking over their shoulders when they're
alone.
<crip> yeah we wouldn't want that....he he he
<crip> oh jeez
<Casey> Sorry, Bookpal.  the duet of Casey and Crip's been in existence for
much too long.  we're bad for people's health now.
<Bookpal> You two are good together!
<crip> surgeon general material
<Bookpal> My hubby just called to tell me there's been a shooting in my
neighborhood. We live in a town of 850
<Casey> Now that is seriously bad.
<crip> yes very bad
<Casey> Good thing you have the dog.
<Bookpal> Either you are extremely good - or I'm losing it in my old age
<Bookpal> I have more than the dog - what I have backs her up
<Casey> We're extremely good (spoken modestly, of course.)
<Bookpal> lol
<Casey> She gives you some warning time, tho.
<Bookpal> That's the whole idea - they do that well
<Casey> Yes indeed.  I'll never be afraid of 60 yo women with poodles
again!
<Bookpal> When I worked with the "guys" I used to ask them what kept them
away. Dogs and outside lights.
<Casey> Depends upon the size of the dog, tho.  My neighbor with a cocker
spaniel was robbed.  They locked the dog in the bathroom while they cleaned
out the house, and must have hit the dog in the process, because the dog
was cowering when my neighbor got home.
<crip> thats terrible
<Bookpal> Hard to believe isn't it?
<crip> people who abuse animals in any situation should be beaten
themselves
<Casey> that they hit the dog was worse than their stealing stuff!
<Casey> Yep.  I agree.
<crip> or stuffed into a kennel for 48 hours.
<Bookpal> If someone asked I would just give them what I have - they don't
think that way
<Casey> I suspect that part of the attraction of violence is the cowering
of other people--their fear.
<Bookpal> I know it would be worse for me
<Bookpal> True
<Bookpal> control
<crip> anyone who hits a dog is a true coward
<Bookpal> I agree
<Casey> How powerful the aggressor feels for those few moments!
<crip> yeah how proud they must brag to others "hey, man, i beat up a dog."
<Bookpal> Sad to imagine what would bring someone to that point
<Casey> He probably then goes home and says, "Yes, ma'am," "No ma'am" to
his mother.
<Bookpal> True. lol
<crip> i can see that
<Bookpal> The guys used to tell me I was safe because they didn't want to
be known for taking on a tiny little old woman.
<Casey> Same with child molesters being on the bottom of the heap in State
prisons.
<Casey> I mean, how much force does it take to harm a child?
<Bookpal> Yes. I worked Protective Custody a lot
<crip> i have to say that those freaks get what they deserve in prison.
even the psychos hate those freaks.
<Bookpal> Believe me, they are whiners
<Casey> Even the "psychos" have a hierarchy.
<crip> yeah
<Bookpal> psychos are fun to work with
<crip> in their minds at least an adult has a chance of defending
themselves
<Casey> Exactly, Crip.
<crip> not to say that it still isn't wrong but to do that to a kid is
unforgivable in their books
<Bookpal> they want "victims" not someone who can defend themselves
<crip> exactly
<Bookpal> I'm hearing sirens now
<Casey> Having that happen to anyone is awful, but I sincerely hope the
shooting hasn't happened to someone you know.
<crip> same here
<Bookpal> Unfortunately because of my job I know almost everyone
<Casey> Doubly tragic then.
<Bookpal> yes
<Casey> How awful!
<Bookpal> Spirit Lake and all of North Idaho is very strange
<Casey> Was the serial killer ever caught?
<Bookpal> Makes it interesting though
<Bookpal> No - it's a tough one
<Casey> He's slippery!
<Casey> How many are credited to him now?
<Bookpal> He doesn't seem to be escalating like you would expect
<Bookpal> 8 this year and they think 3 before
<Casey> I am against the death penalty except in the case of serial
killers.  I think that once someone has killed more than once, he is beyond
trust or hope or "recovery"
<Bookpal> There is a Serial Killer website that I go to. It deals with
profiling
<Casey> That's sounds interesting!
<Bookpal> Prisons don't rehabilitate - they warehouse
<Casey> I know that beyond a doubt.
<Bookpal> It is. One of the victims sisters posts there on the message
board
<Casey> I am sorely resisting giving up and going to bed, but it's almost 3
a.m. here.
<Casey> I must say good night or fall out of this chair.
<Bookpal> Yes, I think we should call it a night.
<crip> yes indeed
<Casey> Crip:  high five, it's been fun, you're a great accomplice.
<Bookpal> Take care both of you
<crip> you too case
<crip> thanks for being the victim, book. you're a good sport
<Bookpal> Will I ever live this down?
<crip> never
<crip> *LOL*
<Casey> Bookpal, I've loved this chat.  come back again now that you're
moved.
<Casey> No, you'll never live it down.
<Bookpal> I plan to
<Bookpal> Um, lets see what I can write for the newsletter
<Bookpal> Sleep well
<Casey> Now, don't even think in that direction!
<Bookpal> Bye. lol
<Casey> bye
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