CHAT ARCHIVE - 9-4-99, Critiques

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       ICQ Chat Save file    
Started on Sun Sep 05 01:16:48 1999

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<Casey> Hi, Kathy. 
<kissfan> hi Casey
<Casey> Did you bring something you're interested in working on tonight?
<kissfan> I do have the first paragraph of the other book that I was trying
to write and can't seem to get far with
<kissfan> Am I the only one tonight?
<Casey> Witchie's joining us for a little while.
<Casey> I haven't seen Rose yet.
<kissfan> Hi SW
<Sea Witch> Hi everyone
<Casey> Hello, Witchie.
<kissfan> I haven't seen Rose either
<Casey> Zen said he might join up with us if he wakes in time, but for now,
this is our group.
<Sea Witch> Who else is coming tonight?
<Sea Witch> Apart from our lord and master
<Casey> Rose had planned to be here, but we haven't seen her yet.
<Sea Witch> Have you any objection if I use an unused part of my last RW
assignment?  I've come to this session rather cold.
<Casey> How's the book editing going, SW?
<Sea Witch> Slowly <g>
<Casey> No objection at all.
<Casey> We use bits and pieces to learn from and experiment with; nothing
has to be something you're planning to use.
<Casey> Rose will be joining us momentarily.
<kissfan> cool.  I have been hiding out so much lately that I have hardly
talked to anyone.
<Casey> Is the second book a sequel or spin-off of your Druid book?
<Sea Witch> Hiding out?  Peek-a-boo!!!!
<kissfan> yes it is.  I plan on telling the story of the magical world that
Journ entered
<kissfan> how and why it was created and things like that
<Casey> What's the working title of your novel?  (the main one)
<kissfan> Land of the Wizards
<Casey> Cool title.
<kissfan> the one with Journ is Destiny Calls
<Casey> That's right.  You've mentioned it before, but I was wracking my
brain trying to remember what it was.
<kissfan> I hope to explain what actually happened to Journ's father in
Wizards
<Casey> Isn't it fun creating entire histories for your characters?
<Sea Witch> Mine seem to unravel as I go along.
<kissfan> Yes it is.  By doing it you end up getting more in touch with
your characters
<Sea Witch> I don't seem to set out writing a character's history.  It just
seems to happen
<kissfan> I am just letting it flow if and when it happens, I just go with
it
<Casey> It tends to happen for me, too:  explaining why he reacts the way
he/she does, etc.
<Sea Witch> Yeah, letting slip bits of information here and there rather
than giving out a data dump.
<Casey> Okay, Rose is taking more time than I anticipated, so I'm going to
jump in with a very brief grammar lesson tonight.
<Sea Witch> I'm all eyes and fingers
<kissfan> The reason I started writing Wizards was that I was having
trouble getting anywhere with Destiny Calls.  I thought that a book with
the history of the land of Tigh was needed
<Casey> We'd discussed split infinitives a while back.  Tonight's lesson
follows that same type of problem:  splitting words that should be kept
together.
<Sea Witch> Know what you mean.  The book I'm writing now is a prequel to
the one I originally wrote!
<kissfan> yep so is Wizards
<Sea Witch> Some split infinitives are a statement unto themselves.  In the
right place they seem right
<Casey> He he.  I wrote Moons' Kiss, began writing its sequel, then decided
that I couldn't publish the sequel without publishing the first book, so
I'm back to book one.
<Sea Witch> Lesson number one.  Don't try and write the second book first!
<g>
<Casey> In rare cases, split infinitives have become acceptable--usually
when there seems no way to join them that isn't terribly awkward.
<kissfan> HEHEE I know what you mean sometimes it happens like that
<Casey> Tonight's lesson is about split verb phrases.
<Sea Witch> Ouch!  Sounds painful
<Casey> Verb phrases are such things as "have been" and "had heard"
<Casey> the "has" and "had" when linked to a main verb is called the
auxiliary verb.
<Casey> The rule is to keep the auxiliary verb and main verb together.
<Sea Witch> So it is poor grammar to say has always been?
<Casey> Don't construct sentences such as:  The speaker has, although one
would hardly believe it, been lecturing for over an hour.
<Casey> Strictly speaking, always has been is the proper grammar, SW.
<Casey> In our speaking voices, we split infinitives and verb phrases all
over the place.
<Sea Witch> Yeah, London, Paris, Rome, Tooting Bec
<Casey> he he!
<kissfan> LOL
<Casey> Also incorrect:  He has, to my surprise, sung very well.
<shorty103> went star gazing tonight and saw my first star up close
<Sea Witch> ???
<Sea Witch> Were you on stilits?
<Casey> Rose, SW is the astronomer.  You had a question for her.
<shorty103> yes I did
<Sea Witch> Or through a telescope?
<Casey> Rose just got a telescope.
<kissfan> sorry weird mood tonight
<shorty103> SW, I put my new telescope together, and I look through it and
everthing is upside down, why does this happen
<Sea Witch> Because that is how your lens works.  Do you want a short
lesson in optics?
<Casey> That's okay, it's a holiday.  We deserve to get weird on holidays.
<shorty103> through the part that you look through, 
<Casey> I'm interested.  Lesson away, SW.
<kissfan> could it be that I have had 5 hours sleep in 3 days???
<shorty103> yes, please SW
<kissfan> go for it SW
<Sea Witch> What sort of 'scope do you have, refracting or reflecting?
<kissfan> Man!!! My speling skcus
<Sea Witch> Ha, ha
<Casey> LOL!  I agree with every misspelled word in that statement.
<shorty103> that part I really don't know, but it's a 525, 60mm dual
purpose one
<kissfan> LOL I can't believe how bad I am spelling tonight
<Sea Witch> Is your objective lens at the end or does it stick out the
side?
<Sea Witch> That's the bit you look through
<shorty103> you can put the lens up and right in the part that is attacted
to the main piece
<Sea Witch> That sounds like a refracting scope.  OK
<Sea Witch> The main lens is convex, that's the big end
<shorty103> okay, so far so good
<Sea Witch> Light strikes the lens and is brought down to a focus on the
secondary lens.  Which is also convex
<shorty103> understood
<Sea Witch> Then it has to expand to fill the eyepiece
<Sea Witch> So it bends the rays again
<Sea Witch> The image becomes twisted by the refraction of the lens and you
see everything upside down
<shorty103> okay, now I understand a little
<Casey> The human eye works in much the same way.
<Sea Witch> To put is simply, the rays from the image are criss-crossed
<shorty103> is there a way of fixing that problem
<Sea Witch> Why would you want to.  When looking at the sky an inverted
image makes no difference
<Casey> And if you're spying on neighbors, an upside down image might not
be so bad.
<kissfan> HEHEE
<shorty103> yes, I do understand the way the eye works, but what about day
time, it's so funny looking at the reversing falls upside down
<Sea Witch> With some of my neighbours it would be beneficial!!!!  Heh, heh
<shorty103> LOL
<kissfan> Mine too HEHEE
<Sea Witch> Get a pair of binocculars.  I'm sorry to say this but a pair of
long focus bins is superior to a 60mm refractor
<shorty103> okay, I should have asked you before I bought this one
<Sea Witch> You didn't know Rose.  I made the same mistake with my first
telescope too <g>
<shorty103> I'm glad that I'm not the only one that makes this mistake
<Sea Witch> After the bins you'll want to see clearer images.  A keen
amateur will quickly move on to a Newtonian reflector.  Nothing less than a
six inch mirror mind
<Sea Witch> You can usually pick one up second hand from someone who has
traded up
<shorty103> Oh my, this is a bigger project than I thought,  I will do it
very slowly or as the money comes due in Jan.
<Casey> I was amazed to learn the different types of telescopes made when I
attended the Science Museaum's astronomer's club and had the opportunity to
look through members' telescopes at the night sky.
<Sea Witch> The bins will do you fine Rose.
<shorty103> okay, and thank you for your help
<Sea Witch> I've always wanted a Cassegrain.  One day I'll get one.
<Sea Witch> Any time Rose
<shorty103> this one I bought is a Tasco, I think that's how you spell it
<Sea Witch> That's exactly how you spell it.  My first one was a Tasco
too!!!
<Casey> What surprised me was how quickly celestrial objects left the
telescope's field of vision.
<shorty103> with the exchange and everything, it came to $375.00
<Sea Witch> Mr. SW bought it for me.  He realised that something bigger was
needed so he built a Newtonian 4.5 inch.  Great for gazing at planets but
not powerful enough for other things
<kissfan> I wish I owned a telescope.  I enjoy watching the stars so much
<Sea Witch> You need a motorised drive to keep the field of view constant
<Casey> The moon is absolutely fascinating through a telescope.
<Sea Witch> Isn't it though!
<shorty103> I am just learning, but I know that I'll get the hang of it
sometime soon.  LOL
<Sea Witch> Learn to navigate the night sky.  Memorise the constellations
<kissfan> I know I saw it up close for the first time through my cousin's
telescope when I was about 6 years old and I have wanted my own telescope
ever since
<shorty103> I did get some charts with it too.
<Casey> That's a big help, Rose.
<kissfan> yes it is
<Sea Witch> If you like looking at the moon here is a project that will
keep you busy for a while.
<Sea Witch> Choose a crater, any crater will do.  Try and view it every
night, weather permitting.
<shorty103> yes, that should be interesting
<Sea Witch> You will see the features of the crater change.  Make a record
and see what you get.
<shorty103> okay
<Casey> Now you have my interest and curiosity piqued, SW.
<kissfan> that sounds like it would be fun and interesting to do
<Sea Witch> Another good one is looking at Jupiter's moons.  They change
position every night.  Try and work out which moon is which
<shorty103> I seem I can find anything out there yet, but I will get the
hang of it 
<Sea Witch> All it takes is practice Rose.  You'll get the hang of it soon
enough.
<Casey> National Geographic's last issue has a really neat article on the
planet's moons.
<Sea Witch> A Phillips star disc will help you to navigate
<shorty103> okay, thanks for the boost, I need that ever once and awhile
<Casey> And thanks for the optics/astronomy lesson, SW.
<Sea Witch> It's difficult without a proper mount and drive
<Sea Witch> <g>
<Casey> (I'm so glad Zen's not yet awake!)
<Sea Witch> Why?
<Casey> Read your last full sentence.
<shorty103> yes, I agree with you SW,  I didn't know what I was getting
into when I bought this, but I'm glad I did
<Sea Witch> Ah, yes.  I see......
<kissfan> OOPS ya really HEHEE
<Sea Witch> Silly Witchie!
<Casey> Now, blushing and moving on . . .
<kissfan> HEHEE
<Casey> Any questions about the grammar lesson?
<kissfan> don't think so
<Sea Witch> Yes.  Splitting verb infinitives is UGLY
<Casey> Just keep your will have been's  and would have sung's together and
you won't get into trouble.
<kissfan> but I will think of some 3 days from now LOLO
<Casey> That's okay, Kathy.  I'll be around 3 days from now, too.
<kissfan> HEHEE ya I know
<Casey> Kathy says she has another opening paragraph to share with us.  Do
you want to go first, Kathy?
<kissfan> sure hold on and I will copy it 
<Casey> Am going for some ice water myself, while we're waiting.
<Sea Witch> So, what got you interested in stargazing, Rose?
<shorty103> Well , it was Jim that wanted one, so he could see who was at
the bottom of the lane, but I seem to have taken it over for my own use
<kissfan> Everyone in the small, druid village of Oshka waited to hear word
from a meeting that was taking place in the town of Gilmet.  Oshka's
council members had sent Tibor, a well respcted member of the council to
the meeting. Even though he was the youngest member of the council, his
wisdom far exceeded his age.  he had always put the welfare of other ahead
of his own.
<Sea Witch> Can't think of a better use myself.  <g>
<Casey> He didn't realize he was going to have to recognize trespassers
upside down.
<Sea Witch> Heh, heh
<shorty103> LOL, your funny tonight Casey
<Casey> A question:  how are the villagers awaiting word?  How will they
get word, in other words.
<kissfan> Well in the next paragraph or so it is found out that Tibor is
heading back form the meeting
<Casey> Exactly, Kathy!  Why not open this paragraph that way?
<Casey> Everyone awaiting Tibor's return.
<kissfan> Ok I was trying to figure out if I should have done that
<Casey> I'm trying to figure out a way to change your statements into
action.
<Casey> That was my lame solution.
<Casey> It might even work to eliminate the first sentence and begin with
the second.
<Casey> Then you'll have to sneak in the town name at the end of that
sentence.
<Casey> (Someone have a more brillaint idea?)
<Sea Witch> How about - The Druids of Osaka awaited word fromGilmet.
<kissfan> some thing like tibor headed back form the meeting that was heald
in Guilmet knowing that the whole village of Oshka would be waiting to hear
what he had found out there.
<shorty103> yes, I just read it over, starting at the second sentence, and
it does sound okay to me that way, but what do i know
<kissfan> or somethiong like that
<Casey> You know what you like, Rose, which is a significant contribution.
You're a reader, too.
<shorty103> okay, but sometimes I get lost and I don't hit everything on
the head right off
<Casey> In your rewrite, you use 2 different village names that aren't
significant to me.  If you say "knowing that his village would . . ." gives
me more information.
<kissfan> yes I see
<Casey> The soonest you can "place" things for me, the better.  Attach
significance to place names, so I have a sense of where and what.
<shorty103> what about using the five w's and how and leave out the who
until last
<kissfan> yes I see what you mean
<Casey> Rose brings up a point worth reiterating.
<shorty103> fictional journalism
<Casey> Yes.
<Casey> The who, what, when, where, and how are just as important in
fiction writing as nonfiction.
<Casey> why, too.
<shorty103> of course, but leave the who until last
<Casey> The techniques of presenting them are different, however.
<shorty103> yes, more description, 
<kissfan> ka, a small druid village in northern Gaul, the people waited to
hear word from Tibor, a respected and loved member of the village council
of leaders.  He had been chosen to attend a meeting to discuss the known
plans of the Roman empire and what was known about Gauls biggest threat to
their survival,  General Julius Ceaser.  He had threatened to wipe out the
whole population of Gaul especially the "dreadful barbaric druids".  The
General hated all people that didn't belong to the great Roman empire.
<kissfan> here is another version of that paragraph
<shorty103> much better in my eyes
<Sea Witch> Says more, better information.  You get to understand what's
going on right away
<kissfan> I have been trying many different ways with it
<shorty103> I like this version better than the first
<Sea Witch> Agreed
<Casey> Yes.  You present a real threat here:  Julius Caesar.
<kissfan> cool that is what I wanted to do with it it also gives a certain
timeline for the story as well
<shorty103> in learning you will teach, in teaching you will learn.  
<Casey> Yes, it immediately "places" the time frame for the story.
<kissfan> That is what I thought too.
<Casey> In teaching, you definitely learn, Rose.
<kissfan> yes you do
<Sea Witch> Does the story include Vercingetorix (did I get that right?)
who held Julie at defiance and almost won him?
<kissfan> actually no The druids send out a small group of people to look
for a safer place to move the village but when none could be found, they
create a new world.
<Sea Witch> Ah, so they flee the threat.  Does history become your own from
thereon in?
<shorty103> interesting thought. create a new world, to bad that couldn't
be done now a days
<kissfan> It will be the very world that Journ enters in Destiny Calls
<kissfan> this is true
<Casey> Aren't we creating a new world today, Rose?
<kissfan> once the world is created it does SW
<Sea Witch> That sounds interesting
<shorty103> yes, but I feel that it is in my imagination most of the time
<Casey> My grandmother would not recognize the world we live in today.
<Sea Witch> My Grandmother doesn't recognise the world we live in today
<shorty103> yes, very true
<Sea Witch> It's almost completely alien to her
<kissfan> That is very true Casey.  Think about how the people from the
colonial days would feel if they saw what we have from today
<shorty103> Jim feels that way too!
<Sea Witch> No bloody colonies for a start off!  Heh, heh
<Casey> I have pictures of Harold's mother and brother sitting atop a
horse-drawn wagon he purchased with his first earned money. 
<kissfan> oh wow 
<kissfan> hehee SW
<Casey> The hope of interstellar travel has become our future "colonies."
<shorty103> yes, and there is a one horse wagon down stairs in my basement,
and it was built back in  1920-21 
<Sea Witch> I bought a pair of new ice skates with my first wage.  That's
inflation for you I suppose
<Casey> That really wasn't so very long ago, Rose, if you think about it. 
<Casey> he he, SW!  You're right about that.
<kissfan> No it really wasn't
<shorty103> one look and there goes your imagination, and we have some
things that are over a hundred and twenty years old here.
<shorty103> mostly rocking chairs
<Sea Witch> Cool
<kissfan> In the first chapter of this book the council members are working
on many different plans for the possible encounter with J.C.
<Sea Witch> What makes them decide to give up and leave?
<Casey> I can picture Tibor returning, full of the arguments and
alternative plans posed in meetings he's attended.
<kissfan> actually they only want to find a place just in case it is needed
but the group never returned because they became "trapped" in the world
that they created. and then the story follows what happened in that world
<kissfan> cool 
<Casey> Do others go looking for the people who never returned?
<shorty103> yes, like taking a journey without leaving in a way
<Sea Witch> Does the world inhabit the same universe or is it somewhere
else?
<kissfan> I never go back to the village once the world of Tigh was
created.  Not until Journ is of age to go out in Destiny Calls
<Casey> Tibor is Journ's father?
<kissfan> It is like a parallel universe,sort of.
<kissfan> Yes Tibor is Journs father
<Casey> Ahh, so there are people who go looking for the lost individuals.
Very good.
<shorty103> in the way that your describing it, it's like sliders,  same
time frame, but a different universe
<kissfan> yes I figured that having Journ go out in the next book would tie
the two together
<kissfan> ya sort of.  It seems to be that a certain part of each member of
the group goes into the magic that creates the new world
<kissfan> including the Druid's love of nature
<Casey> I received 2 opening paragraphs after we'd already done the
workshop on beginnings.
<Sea Witch> Who from?
<Casey> Max Davidson.
<Casey> I'm hunting them up now.  One has already been critiqued by the
whole group.  The other hasn't.
<kissfan> Who is Max??? I haven't met him, have I
<Casey> No one's met him in chat that I know about. 
<Sea Witch> Max is a very sensitive individual
<Casey> I don't think he has ICQ.
<kissfan> ok just wondering 
<Casey> SW, would you like to present your paragraph next, or shall we do
Max's new submission?
<shorty103> Casey, the heat is taking everything out of me, I can't seem to
concentrate, you don't mind if I leave early, just can't think, eyes are
closing.
<Sea Witch> Poor Rose.
<Casey> I don't mind at all, Rose.  Your health is of primary concern.
<Sea Witch> Do Max's
<Casey> Go take care of yourself.
<kissfan> I know what you mean Rose it can be so draining
<shorty103> thank you
<Sea Witch> Bye Rose.  See you soon
<Casey> Goodnight.  Take care.
<kissfan> Bye Rose take care
<Casey>  Insanity, as well as sanity, is a fragile thing, defined by a
fragile, fine line that is--for most men--just exactly that: a mere thread
always under immense pressure, a boundary made to be crossed by the
self-uncontrolled.  Very few luxuriate in a life of undoubted sanity, most
strain to keep the subject from surfacing their mind, and yet more fall
prey to the alluring appeal of freedom...
<Sea Witch> Phew!  A pause to draw breath
<Casey> I take it that "Insanity" came through.
<kissfan> yep really strong
<Casey> The other opening paragraph he submitted was SlaveWorld, which most
of us have read.
<Sea Witch> Read more like a treatise on psychology to me
<kissfan> it is like the main character is struggling with his own sanity
<Casey> That was the notable thing that jumped out at me, SW:  that both of
them open with philosophical statements.
<Casey> Both required me to read very slowly in order to follow the thread
of what he is presenting.
<Sea Witch> I know what you mean.  It doesn't read like a story.
<kissfan> I had to read it a few times to get the thread
<kissfan> and I am not sure that I got it right either
<Casey> Exactly, Kathy.  Which isn't what you want in an opening paragraph.
I'd be too afraid that the rest of the story read the same way.
<kissfan> yes I would be real afraid to go on with it
<Casey> Even if the story is incredibly brilliant, I'm concerned that few
people would read far enough to discover that.
<Casey> Philosophical ideas are too easy to dispute, so if I totally
disagree with his premise in this paragraph, I would not read further,
period.
<Casey> That's another danger.
<kissfan> I usually chose the books and stories I read by the first
paragraphs and with that one I am afraid I would put the book down and not
pick it back up again
<Casey> What surprised me, was that in our Beginnings workshop, Chip
presented the opening paragraph of Edgar Allen Poe's short story, which
also dealt with sanity/insanity.  Remember?
<kissfan> Yes I do 
<Sea Witch> I don't like Poe.
<Sea Witch> I haven't read his short story
<Casey> The difference was, Poe's was chilling in its immediate
identification with the speaker.
<Sea Witch> There is no immediacy about Max's opening words
<kissfan> Yes which can pull a reader in just to find out what happens in
the story
<Casey> Max's submission doesn't have that link to a protagonist.
<Casey> Exactly, SW.
<kissfan> yes it just kind of sits there making me wonder if I want to go
on with the story. no action
<Sea Witch> And they read like a lecture.  People don't usually like being
lectured to
<kissfan> yes very true. 
<kissfan> makes you feel like you are in a psych class
<Casey> He has a skill with creating mood, but he needs to link that mood
to a person, someone a reader can identify with immediately.
<Sea Witch> Which is the point that was made with SlaveWorld.
<kissfan> Yes He never mentions who or why the statements were made in the
first place
<Casey> It's almost as if he hasn't taken a long, hard look at himself and
his own emotions to know how they're connected.
<Sea Witch> Which is a dead giveaway to Max's age
<Casey> He's keeping that distance from himself in the characters he
writes.
<Sea Witch> Which is why they'll remain 1 dimensional until he learns to do
otherwise
<kissfan> Yes and to make each charactor interesting a small part of the
writer has to come through in some way
<Casey> The writer must integrate with his characters--become that
character.
<kissfan> I find that the Main characters in my stories seem to have a bit
of me in each one, not that I try to do it that way it just happens
<Sea Witch> And he has to care about his characters.  You can't write a
character without having respect for your creation
<Casey> That's true even of the bad guys.
<kissfan> Yes thoughts and feelings.  It helps when you can feel and know
how they feel and why they feel the way they do.
<Sea Witch> Max has no respect for his characters, only for stringing long
words together in increasingly meaningless ways.
<Casey> Okay, we've beatten up Max's submission.  Do you dare let us have a
swing at yours, Witchie?
<Sea Witch> Pity really because if he wrote from the heart as well as the
brain he might make a decent author
<kissfan> I agree SW
<Sea Witch> Yeah, OK.
<Casey> There is potential in his writing.  I'd like to see something he's
written in 20 years.
<Sea Witch> The majestic pinnacles and crags cast sullen shadows over the
Dakarah's western flank.  The lofty blue-white peaks, limned with roseate
light from the rising sun, dominated the flawless blue of the sky. 
<Sea Witch> A movement beneath the eaves of the alpine forest disturbed a
family of foraging crows.  They  took flight on wings black as a torturer's
heart, scolding the intruder with raucous zeal.  The rider halted, a
playful zephyr caught at his cloak, and toyed with pine boughs above his
head.  Light and shade rippled across his face, dancing to the sighing tune
of the mountain air.  He cocked his head and listened.  Not to the
whispering forest nor to the calls of its denizens.  He listened for
something else; something that didn't belong. 
<Sea Witch> OK, I've donned my flak jacket.  Fire away!  <g>
<kissfan> WOW I like your descriptions!
<Sea Witch> Thanks Kissfan.
<Casey> What's a zephyr?
<Sea Witch> A playful breeze
<Casey> Ahhh!  I was trying to link "The rider halted" to a zephyr. 
<kissfan> Maybe you should have said "a playfull breeze"
<Sea Witch> <g>  Maybe I should
<Casey> One doesn't logically follow the halting.
<Sea Witch> Perhaps I need a strategic "and"
<Casey> I think you need an explanatory, "When the rider halted, "
<Casey> Something's needed there.
<Sea Witch> I agree
<Casey> The first 2 sentences contrast each other.   The first sets an
image of "dark" and "shadowy," the second, of a clear spring afternoon.
<Sea Witch> There's a lot of shade and large patches of light in the
mountains.  I actually described something I've seen
<Casey> It made me wonder which image I'm supposed to pay more attention
to.
<Sea Witch> The contrast is very stark in the early morning
<Casey> I agree fully.  I love the mountains for its atmosphere and
contrasting lights. 
<kissfan> try putting the time of day in there then show the contrasting
light
<Casey> But this is where fiction writing departs from stark reality.
<Sea Witch> The rising sun indicates morning
<kissfan> oops I missed that when I read it over again sorry
<Sea Witch> Stark reality can be better than fiction
<Casey> You can describe the same scene while keeping your mood on the same
side.
<Sea Witch> OK, I've taken that on board.  What would you suggest
<Casey> You want to keep the dark and ominous feeling, am I correct?
<Casey> Things about to happen
<Sea Witch> Yes
<Sea Witch> That's right
<Casey> If you eliminate lofty and flawless from the description (and the
second "blue"), that goes far to keep the same tone as the opening
sentence.
<Casey> Instead of repeating blue, you could add new description, such as
cloudless.
<Sea Witch> You're right, it does.  Thanks Casey
<Casey> I've found with my own writing that what is likely to get me in the
most trouble (description-wise) are adjectives.
<Sea Witch> Yeah, I tend to be a little heavy on the adjectives myself
<kissfan> it is easy to do
<Casey> Many times, if I simply delete an adjective I've used, I eliminate
the objection others have with my descriptions.
<Sea Witch> Too many adjectives gives you mental indigestion!
<kissfan> HEHEE
<Casey> They can refine a noun just a tad bit too much for others' liking,
at times.
<Casey> or narrow a noun, maybe.
<Sea Witch> Sometimes I find it difficult striking a balance between the
two.
<Casey> Strong nouns, such as "sapwood" or "heartwood" are more vivid than
"exposed wood."
<kissfan> ya so do I at times, actually most of the time HEHEE
<Sea Witch> It's so easy to get carried away
<Casey> Yes, it is.
<Sea Witch> I like inventing nouns
<Casey> But you'll never, as hard as you try, get as wild as "The
Gormenghast Trilogy"!
<Sea Witch> That is OTT big way
<Casey> What's OTT?
<Sea Witch> Over The Top
<Casey> (Talk English, Woman!)
<Sea Witch> I am
<Sea Witch> Heh, heh
<Casey> he he.  That's so true.
<Casey> So, the big question:  When are you getting back to your writing?
<Sea Witch> As soon as possible.
<Casey> There's a prince impaled on rocks at the bottom of a cliff that has
me worried.
<Sea Witch> He'll keep!
<Casey> I hope it's cold as well as morning, then.
<Sea Witch> You already know he gets rescued
<Casey> That's beside the point.
<Sea Witch> He's  too busy to shiver methinks
<Casey> (I'm the one who made you swear you wouldn't kill him off.)
<Sea Witch> I never had any intention of doing so
<Casey> The cold will help preserve him until his rescue.
<Casey> Ahhhh!  So you were teasing me!  For shame!
<Sea Witch> No, his wits preserve him
<Sea Witch> And luck, of course
<kissfan> now you have really sparked my curiosity guys HEHEE
<Casey> SW writes well, Kathy.  She just won't do enough of it.
<Sea Witch> For "won't" read "can't"
<Casey> Okay.  I forgive you.  I'm guilty as sin for not writing, myself.
<kissfan> Yes I saw that in that paragraph I don't write enough either.  I
want to but I find that there isn't enough time in the day HEHEE but I do
try at least even if it is just a paragraph or 2.
<Sea Witch> Take a lesson from Casey and I, Kissfan.  Don't let outside
distractions take you away from your writing.
<Sea Witch> The Prince isn't my main character you know.
<kissfan> I try not to let distractions take me away from it. I have
started taking notebooks with me to my sister's house when I babysit
<Sea Witch> In fact, he started off life as the bad guy but I got to like
him too much
<Casey> That's a good habit to develop, Kathy.  I was able to write nightly
for quite a few years, but alas, those days are gone.
<Sea Witch> Good idea Kissfan
<kissfan> LOL that happens sometimes
<Casey> The guy you beat to a bloody pulp is your hero, right?
<Sea Witch> Yeah
<Sea Witch> Evil cackle
<kissfan> If I have my notebooks with me when an idea strikes I can write
it down and it won't get lost
<Casey> I'm thankful I'm not one of your protagonists!
<Sea Witch> I'm thinking of toning things down a little
<Casey> I've kept notebooks, too.  That's a great help.
<Sea Witch> I get carried away describing gory bits
<Casey> Remember, who you beat up has to recover later, and that takes time
out from action.
<Sea Witch> I have a notebook full of wonderful ideas.  I've never used a
dman one of them
<kissfan> Hubby says I have too many notebooks around the house LOL
<Casey> I noticed your love of violence!
<kissfan> I don't think I have enough notebooks HEHEE
<Sea Witch> I'm not violent by nature but I love exploring my dark side
<Casey> The problem I've found with notebooks is going through them when
you're looking for one particular bit of info you KNOW you wrote down
somewhere.
<kissfan> Yes it is like your "dark side" emerges HEHEE
<Sea Witch> Just so long as it isn't my backside <g>
<Casey> he he he!
<kissfan> The funny thing is that I write my stories in longhand first then
I transfer and work on them as I put them onto the disk
<Sea Witch> My stories would never get written if I did that
<Casey> Chip and I were discussing one night how mild-mannered we are as
opposed to the gruesome and gory things we put our characters through.  We
wondered if more mass murders wrote, would the crime rate drop?
<Sea Witch> That's a very good question.  I'm sure there's a story in it
somewhere....
<kissfan> I have too I am away from the pc way too much.  That is why I do
it that way
<kissfan> Yes it is a very good question.
<kissfan> I have been wanting a laptop pc HEHEE
<Sea Witch> I've wanted to write stories since I was 15.  Alas, I'm
something of a lazy beggar.  Had I been the slightest bit religious I would
have got down on my hands and kness and thanked God for word processing
software
<Casey> Not me!  When I'm away from the pc, I want to be totally away from
it!
<Casey> I remember the good old days of typing and retyping and retyping
stories on a manual then an electric typewriter.  Remember those?
<Sea Witch> No, I wouldn't do it.
<Sea Witch> I had a portable typewriter but it died from misuse
<kissfan> but it is when I am "away from it" that I get me best thoughts.
If I had a laptop to take to me sister's place then I wouldn't have to
worry I could just start it up and go with the flow
<kissfan> I have them HEHEE
<Sea Witch> I usually get my best ideas in the shower.  All that hot water
smacking into my head must drive home the nifty stuff
<kissfan> LOL not even pen and paper would work there 
<Casey> I get most of my characters' problems resolved while soaking in the
bathtub.  Or just as I'm falling asleep.
<Sea Witch> There must be something about hot water that gets the creative
juices flowing
<Casey> Must be the relaxation thing.
<Sea Witch> Maybe blissful relaxation is the key
<Sea Witch> Ah, ha!  Snap
<kissfan> so that second paragraph I showed you was definitely better then?
<Casey> Yes.  You gave us something to be fearful about.
<kissfan> cool and would you believe that it was the original way that I
wrote it and then lost it
<Casey> The first one had him returning from a meeting in the next village,
without a hint of danger.
<kissfan> Ya I agree with you I just couldn't find the original one for a
long time
<kissfan> I had even lost my notebooks for a long time
<Casey> I'm glad you located it.
<kissfan> Ya me too!  
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